Permanently banned from /r/ID_News without warning, and all comments removed, after being a long time participant with no previous removals/warnings/bans, simply for having the audacity to have a different, entirely fact/evidence-based opinion on COVID-19 shutdowns 📦

122    17 Jun 2020 14:08 by u/MaximilianKohler

42 comments

38 u/Rob_Dead 17 Jun 2020 15:03
You made the error of presenting an unapologetic informed opinion backed up by facts. On Reddit.
2 u/[deleted] * 18 Jun 2020 13:28
[deleted]
22 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 17 Jun 2020 14:17
A single narrative that ignores all the consequences of shut downs is being forced across reddit. Here's more examples of the same thing happening in /r/economics: https://archive.vn/wip/UbC0K - https://archive.vn/wip/DDwDh I talked to someone who lives in Beijing and not even he knows how people are expected to survive without work and welfare.
3 u/XxTyraelxX 17 Jun 2020 17:52
Oh yeah, the current narrative is shutdown or you're the most selfish, POS imaginable... unless you're rioting and looting in which case carry on because you're doing God's work.
7 u/Alwayspriority 17 Jun 2020 18:15
For the record, you're non alone in your stance. Take it as a badge of honor. While it may SEEM like the hive mind of reddit appears to take that stance, I believe it's a minority on a global scale. Seriously, when does destroying careers and bankrupting a huge swath of the population of earth outweigh the deaths of a portion of those who are unhealthy to begin with? Not an easy call to make. Those leaders who have stood up and made these hard decisions should be praised.
6 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 17 Jun 2020 18:18
> I believe it's a minority on a global scale Yet it's being forced in virtually every country, and only a small amount of people are protesting.
5 u/former_Democrat 18 Jun 2020 04:31
Because protesting lockdowns means you're a racist and nazi /s
3 u/CptHammer_ 18 Jun 2020 05:10
The biggest curiosity I can see is that the entire world decided this was a good idea to start for a short time. The goal was to slow, not stop, the spread. Goal achieved. Authoritarian regimes moved the goal posts, either out of fear of their ill informed electorate or malice to the middle and working classes to keep them down. Big companies and the wealthy are hardly effected.
7 u/TaxAllHairDye 17 Jun 2020 18:35
I don't understand why this is such a taboo topic. * There's no willingness to quantify a death in terms of "years of life lost" * There's no willingness to discuss unintended consequences such as suicide, foregoing preventative care, various negative impacts from unemployment, various mental health issues, etc. * There's little willingness to discuss what actually is/isn't risky behavior.
6 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] * 17 Jun 2020 18:45
Indeed. In my opinion it's due to two reasons: 1. The narrative is being manipulated. 2. The average person does not have the cognitive capacity to weigh all the various factors, outcomes, etc., and instead just have an emotional reaction of "oh my god people are dying" triggered in their brain that overrides all critical thinking. Unfortunately, this type of cognitive capacity deficit and emotional thinking extends into the medical community. I've seen many examples of this including c-sections and antibiotics. ### C-sections: C-sections are known to be harmful, and the WHO recommends a rate of ~10%, while most countries are 3-4x higher than that. Time to consider the risks of caesarean delivery for long term child health (2015) https://www.bmj.com/content/350/bmj.h2410 There's a doctor in the comments of that article arguing against giving informed consent to parents, and saying we should continue to ignore the long-term harms. >As an obstetrician, I would rather deliver 1,000 healthy babies who develop asthma and diabetes in later life than deal with 1 intra-partum stillbirth. As a parent, I would rather have 1,000 children with a chronic illness than 1 dead baby. https://www.bmj.com/content/350/bmj.h2410/rr ### Antibiotics: Antibiotics are known to have severe, long-term detriments: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/bat7ml/while_antibiotic_resistance_gets_all_the/ Yet 3 people in the US who set the guidelines for everyone are refusing to recognize all the evidence that goes against their recommendations due to emotional thinking of *"but babies are dying; we have to do something, even if that something isn't scientific"*: https://archive.vn/EUpRv
3 u/hhxrx 17 Jun 2020 20:21
> As an obstetrician, I would rather deliver 1,000 healthy babies who develop asthma and diabetes in later life than deal with 1 intra-partum stillbirth. As a parent, I would rather have 1,000 children with a chronic illness than 1 dead baby. modern medicine is consumer prostitution. a sick, demented child will consume medical interventions for the rest of his or her life. good for business.
2 u/Adept-Instance 19 Jun 2020 05:06
Just put em down like a dog, amirite? /s if it wasn’t obvious
1 u/Adept-Instance 19 Jun 2020 05:05
So for the trolley thought experiment, is it safe to assume you will without hesitation choose a loved one to die in the place of six strangers since it’s a numbers game or do you have some sort of empathy and need time to deliberate?
1 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 19 Jun 2020 05:28
As I said to another user in one of the links, if you think my position is one of no empathy you're misunderstanding everything I'm arguing. Additionally, your comment demonstrates exactly what the person I was arguing with demonstrated - your emotions block out your ability for logical thinking and objective analysis.
1 u/Adept-Instance 19 Jun 2020 05:39
I asked if you would have empathy in evaluating the question, to see if it was simply sociopathy, I wasn’t assuming you to save either party or even get involved I wanted to know if you have a shred of empathy. As for your other points, certified physicians will know more about medicine than you (the scientific side and human side unless you’re some kind of all-knowing savant). As for the pandemic response, shut downs were implemented to prevent more deaths than would be caused by economic harm, but no you probably know better than all health professionals. You seem to enjoy clinging to your self proclaimed prowess with analytics and seem to be a self declared expert on all topics regarding health, global affairs, and philosophy. A few people claiming ideas that go against all of the established literature in health are generally regarded as jokes unless they have substantial evidence. Saving one child is worth exposing 199 children to antibiotics because those children all had the same risk of infection and the long term effects are minimal if any, gut flora can be restored but only if they’re alive.
1 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 19 Jun 2020 14:24
> Saving one child is worth exposing 199 children to antibiotics because those children all had the same risk of infection and the long term effects are minimal if any, gut flora can be restored but only if they’re alive. Wrong. Your entire comment is low quality drivel.
1 u/Adept-Instance 19 Jun 2020 18:04
Well it seems the mods of that other sub agree with me and nice one word response. Medicine and research are two separate things. Research is strictly scientific, medicine has to involve the human component, we (at least everyone I know that has gone in the last decade) were literally taught courses in empathy and ethical decision making. One of those ethical tools is helping versus harming, if the aid outweighs the harm then it is obligatory to provide that service. If there is more harm like your claiming the consensus would be to not provide the service. You are a little disconnected and seem to see people as numbers rather than patients with individual lives, it isn't "emotions clouding judgement" it is emotions being used to under patient situations to help ease their care. No one wants a robot. Besides you are so high and mighty with your microbiome work that makes you an expert in medical ethics, so how can the gut not be re-cultured when there are literally procedures to do that exact thing? Even in the worst of cases, fecal transplants do exist and that's if the patient doesn't bounce back from the antibiotic treatment themselves which most do.
2 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 19 Jun 2020 18:22
> If there is more harm like your claiming the consensus would be to not provide the service. That's exactly the problem. The people responsible for making that analysis and decision are incompetent, and thus doing vastly more harm than help. You would realize that if you bothered to review what I wrote and linked to, but it was obvious you did not. >You are a little disconnected and seem to see people as numbers rather than patients with individual lives That's exactly the problem. Emotion clouding your judgement, blocking your ability for objective, statistical analysis. >it isn't "emotions clouding judgement" it is emotions being used to under patient situations to help ease their care. No one wants a robot. This is a ridiculous and infuriating statement, made even more so by the fact that you seem to be saying that you yourself are in medicine. If that's the case then you are the one responsible for needless harming millions of innocent lives. You are the one responsible for increasing vast amounts of suffering due to chronic disease and poor development. You are the one responsible for the vast majority of the population being extremely poorly developed and poorly functioning, resulting in a total dystopia. Because you and your peers are flawed emotional beings unable to make rational, objective, cost-based analysis and decisions. >so how can the gut not be re-cultured when there are literally procedures to do that exact thing? Try reading what I wrote and linked to. Antibiotics do permanent damage. FMT may not even be able to fully restore the damage, and FMT is not currently widely available, despite my best efforts to make it so. >if the patient doesn't bounce back from the antibiotic treatment themselves which most do. Bullshit. Try reading what I wrote and linked to.
1 u/hhxrx 19 Jun 2020 18:26
iatrogenesis is a leading cause of death in the west, way, WAY more deadly than "seasonal flu #19". Where's our marches and protests for the hundreds of thousands who die in car accidents? Where's the outcry? Such debates threaten consumption, and are therefore suppressed.
1 u/hhxrx 19 Jun 2020 18:24
CONSOOOOOM MEDICAL INTERVENCHUNNNN
4 u/Neoxide 17 Jun 2020 19:44
Pushing a narrative is more important than being ideologically consistent. This isn't happening just on reddit, it's happening all over the internet. Reddit is just one place that allows a small group of people to control a large amount of info with massive censorship based on the policy of "mods can make up the rules and ban people arbitrarily".
2 u/radioactivecowz 18 Jun 2020 07:30
Yeah it blows my how little money people in the US and other places received while in lockdown. I've been off work for almost 3 months cause of closures and have basically been receiving my full pay the entire time. A one time payment of $1200 is an absolute joke
7 u/Terminal-Psychosis 17 Jun 2020 18:21
At some point people have to acknowledge that 3 months with no income is detrimental. "lives are more important than economy" is very dishonest. OP is talking about LIVES... of countless people who cannot feed their kids, pay rent, etc... So many have lost jobs, as well as small businesses going bankrupt. Not wanting to wear a mask shopping is silly, not wanting to lose your business, or wanting to just EAT, is fully sane and reasonable. The ban was undeserved. The comments are... extremely strange.
4 u/notathug 17 Jun 2020 23:50
This is a purging of ideas that does not fit the narrative. We are screwed if something doesn't give.
1 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 17 Jun 2020 23:55
> We are screwed if something doesn't give /r/RedditAlternatives is our only hope.
3 u/[deleted] 18 Jun 2020 05:29
[removed]
2 u/ChocktawRidge 17 Jun 2020 18:57
I'm saving that for the future. Good job! Not everyone believes like them but that certainly is the bill of goods they are selling.
2 u/londonmenace 17 Jun 2020 23:32
I can't see why Reddit doesn't clamp down on these asshole mods.
2 u/Farmerbob1 18 Jun 2020 01:58
Ouch. Read through your posts. Seemed too fact based and rational for Reddit to allow it to remain visible.
1 u/imahik3r † 17 Jun 2020 17:18
All socialists are all cut from the same cowardly cloth. https://www.businessinsider.com/people-who-were-erased-from-history-2013-12
1 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] † 17 Jun 2020 17:22
1. That's a ridiculous statement. 2. What does that have to do with this?
-4 u/imahik3r 17 Jun 2020 17:26
If you can't keep up, maybe you should go back to the kiddy table.
3 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 17 Jun 2020 17:38
You're so right. Your intelligence is just so high that we can't keep up with it. It's not that you didn't read the OP and instead just came in and posted your random propaganda. It's that you're just so much more intelligent than everyone else that you're the only one who can see the intricate web of conspiracies linking rampant mod abuse and censorship on reddit to socialists around the world. Great job.
-3 u/imahik3r 17 Jun 2020 17:39
> . Your intelligence is just so high that we can't keep up with it. No. just you. You're retarded. and also now blocked. I have no time for the ravings of a short-bus drop out.
3 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 17 Jun 2020 17:41
> I have no time for the ravings of a short-bus drop out. Way to go with that [psychological projection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection)! Good job buddy. Block everyone who questions your crazy conspiracy theories!
1 u/GhettoBlasterRKO 17 Jun 2020 18:56
> and also now blocked LOL You lost this one clearly.
1 u/Terminal-Psychosis 17 Jun 2020 18:31
Hard to tell what Mr. Hik3r's point here is, with the link behind a paywall. A bit of explanation could have made this a worthy discussion. Instead, it turned into a shit-slinging contest. :( This is a typical Shareblue / rabid leftist propaganda tactic. Thinking Mr. Hik3r is deliberately trying to derail a valuable and reasonable conversation. Again, hard to say with the link they provided being unreadable, and no explanation to the meaning meant. "socialists" ... or neolibs... they're pushing for massive lockdown, deamonizing any reasonable objections against as insane, but go on to fully promote mass riots, looting, arson, rape and murder over media hype. Laughably, after fully promoting HUGE congregations of people, they are dead set against personal voting, pushing for mail-in ballots that are notoriously prone to massive voter fraud.
-3 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] 17 Jun 2020 19:03
> pushing for mail-in ballots that are notoriously prone to massive voter fraud This is misinformation. You need to diversify your news sources. PBS, NPR, Democracy Now, and more have all done good jobs at covering mail in ballots and COVID. https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mail-in-ballot-voter-fraud/ https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/04/07/829323152/fact-check-is-mail-ballot-fraud-as-rampant-as-president-trump-says-it-is https://www.factcheck.org/2020/04/trumps-latest-voter-fraud-misinformation/ https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/494189-lets-put-the-vote-by-mail-fraud-myth-to-rest
1 u/Nesano 17 Jun 2020 22:50
Mods are subhuman.
1 u/GoingForwardIn2018 18 Jun 2020 00:03
You forgot to mention it's also wrong. Absolutely no one wants to get COVID-19, and avoiding Coronavirus is the best way not to get it. Imagine being a "healthy" person in the middle of their life and contracting a virus that turns you into an old person 50 years early...
0 u/MaximilianKohler [OP] † 18 Jun 2020 00:17
>Imagine being a "healthy" person in the middle of their life and contracting a virus that turns you into an old person 50 years early... Imagine being a healthy person in the middle of their life and a werewolf eats you.
0 u/GoingForwardIn2018 18 Jun 2020 00:40
Far less likely and not as terrifying as becoming a werewolf.