I like how, in their examples at least, the men are saying what they have to look up and the women are crying discrimination before it even happens. As if being self critical isn't a desired trait in a coder.
Every time there's an article whining about whiteboard interviews or algorithm questions, I just remember how I've never interviewed anyone who was bad at whiteboarding who turned out to be a good hire, nor who was good at whiteboarding that turned out to be a bad hire.
Also when you read into such articles, usually it gets away from the merit of whiteboard questions to "I promise I can do good work even though I can't satisfactorily answer your interview questions."
Ok, buddy. Accept that you are not what the company is looking for. Nobody owes you a job.
Very true, I'm a new grad who has been interviewing around and at first I was getting my ass handed to me. I wasn't expecting some of the simple data structures and other questions. The reality is, if you can't answer these questions, chances are someone else interviewing were able to. And guess who they're gonna favor. I've finally landed an interview with a big company (not big 4, but close) and I've got a 3 hour interview next week. Only hope is to study most of this week to be best prepared for any related questions.
Nobody needs a bubble-sort implementer. They need proof that you retain at least some of the concepts of "data structures" and "algorithms" so that they have a reasonable expectation that when you are presented with problems whose solutions will involve those things, you will have some idea of where to begin and will be able to use your time to solve the problem, instead of taking up other employees' time.
Also when you read into such articles, usually it gets away from the merit of whiteboard questions to "I promise I can do good work even though I can't satisfactorily answer your interview questions."
But I will fail the white board because my mind is wired to solve real stuff not stupid silly Fibonacci Numbers.
But here is the thing, you ask me the question and give me the time and Internet. I will come back an give you not only different variations of what you asked, I will probably also create a new one you never seen before that is even better.
A lot of those seem to be missing the point (or they suffered through whiteboard interviews that missed the point). A whiteboard interview shouldn't be about your ability to recall language- or library-specific interfaces. It should be about your ability to understand and solve a problem.
If you don't know how to get the length of a string in Python 3, that's not a problem. If you don't know that getting the length of a string is a thing you can do, then that's a problem.
I agree. If you do not remember the standard syntax/API, just define a syntax/API of your choice and use it consistently. Serious interviewers are interested in being able to solve problems given whatever interface fate shoves down your throat. Sure, some will only care about the exact syntax of some library, but you don't want to work for such idiots in the first place. That library is likely to be obsolete in a few years.
I think white board is fine as long as the expectations are rational. I think Google has a reputation for looking for a specific algorithm rather than assessing problem solving ability. If you need something to be fast you'd research it anyways or an architect would specify the algorithm. The correctly remember a specific algorithm exercise doesn't really have real world applications but hiring is a mistake minimizing activity not a hiring maximizing one.
13 comments
9 u/Wahaha 28 Feb 2017 23:15
Well, this escalated quickly into a diversification scam.
1 u/sparts 01 Mar 2017 16:30
I like how, in their examples at least, the men are saying what they have to look up and the women are crying discrimination before it even happens. As if being self critical isn't a desired trait in a coder.
9 u/SpottyMatt 28 Feb 2017 23:38
Every time there's an article whining about whiteboard interviews or algorithm questions, I just remember how I've never interviewed anyone who was bad at whiteboarding who turned out to be a good hire, nor who was good at whiteboarding that turned out to be a bad hire.
Also when you read into such articles, usually it gets away from the merit of whiteboard questions to "I promise I can do good work even though I can't satisfactorily answer your interview questions."
Ok, buddy. Accept that you are not what the company is looking for. Nobody owes you a job.
The discrimination angle is new, though.
3 u/iamn1ck 01 Mar 2017 00:07
Very true, I'm a new grad who has been interviewing around and at first I was getting my ass handed to me. I wasn't expecting some of the simple data structures and other questions. The reality is, if you can't answer these questions, chances are someone else interviewing were able to. And guess who they're gonna favor. I've finally landed an interview with a big company (not big 4, but close) and I've got a 3 hour interview next week. Only hope is to study most of this week to be best prepared for any related questions.
0 u/SpottyMatt 01 Mar 2017 04:08
That's the key.
Nobody needs a bubble-sort implementer. They need proof that you retain at least some of the concepts of "data structures" and "algorithms" so that they have a reasonable expectation that when you are presented with problems whose solutions will involve those things, you will have some idea of where to begin and will be able to use your time to solve the problem, instead of taking up other employees' time.
1 u/Atarian 01 Mar 2017 12:15
Maybe they should do it on a blackboard.
0 u/roznak 01 Mar 2017 21:06
But I will fail the white board because my mind is wired to solve real stuff not stupid silly Fibonacci Numbers.
But here is the thing, you ask me the question and give me the time and Internet. I will come back an give you not only different variations of what you asked, I will probably also create a new one you never seen before that is even better.
4 u/tame 01 Mar 2017 02:37
A lot of those seem to be missing the point (or they suffered through whiteboard interviews that missed the point). A whiteboard interview shouldn't be about your ability to recall language- or library-specific interfaces. It should be about your ability to understand and solve a problem.
If you don't know how to get the length of a string in Python 3, that's not a problem. If you don't know that getting the length of a string is a thing you can do, then that's a problem.
1 u/littul_kitton 01 Mar 2017 03:24
I agree. If you do not remember the standard syntax/API, just define a syntax/API of your choice and use it consistently. Serious interviewers are interested in being able to solve problems given whatever interface fate shoves down your throat. Sure, some will only care about the exact syntax of some library, but you don't want to work for such idiots in the first place. That library is likely to be obsolete in a few years.
1 u/sparts 01 Mar 2017 16:37
I think white board is fine as long as the expectations are rational. I think Google has a reputation for looking for a specific algorithm rather than assessing problem solving ability. If you need something to be fast you'd research it anyways or an architect would specify the algorithm. The correctly remember a specific algorithm exercise doesn't really have real world applications but hiring is a mistake minimizing activity not a hiring maximizing one.