Coding Bootcamps ?.
10 15 Mar 2016 19:30 by u/NeedACareer
Hi!
Recently i've been looking into programming and i've been considering the options out there.When i asked around here a lot of people recommended me to just self learn through online sources.Although i've started doing that im starting to wonder about coding bootcamps.
I seem to find mixed reviews however most of the coding bootcamps seem to clain a very high 90+% employment rate on their graduates.They make everything sound great as one would imagine , however what is the reality?. I seem to find a lot of mixed reviews about and was hoping maybye some more experienced people around here could offer me some insight.
Thanks!
TLDR: Coding bootcamps scam, not scam, worth it ? Bootcamp VS Self Learning.
11 comments
1 u/heebiejeebie 15 Mar 2016 20:11
Coding bootcamp graduate here. 90% employment rate is true, if you consider people will get jobs some time after the bootcamp. I saw couple of people get hired as in-house instructors, but aside from that I have no idea how well my cohort did. People who do find jobs soon after the bootcamp were mostly people with desirable skillsets whom only needed coding experience, or some were programming prodigies.
Biggest benefit bootcamps offer is the networking opportunity. Students encourage and compete each other to be better, while offering helpful perspectives. On a realistic note, they also boost your LinkedIn views and skill endorsements.
Two biggest factors are time and money. Do you need to attain certain level of skill right away? Can you spare the ridiculously high tuition fee or afford a loan for it?
If yes to both, go for it.
My friends recommend an undergraduate degree coupled with certifications. Personally I think self-learning coupled with open source projects/internship is the best.
1 u/RevanProdigalKnight 15 Mar 2016 20:22
One StackExchange answer I read once (can't find it right now for some reason) said that the primary purpose of certifications is to make money for the certifying organization, and that these days with online resources abundant they don't have as much value as they did even just 10 years ago.
That said, there are a lot of people applying to programming jobs these days that have very little real-life experience in the languages they say they know, and some companies are starting to incorporate a small coding challenge into the interview process, so I'd say the most important aspect of learning a programming language is mastering the basics; conditions, loops, and functions. Once you've got that down in one or two languages, you can start to branch out into more complicated structures and more sophisticated solutions.
0 u/NeedACareer [OP] 15 Mar 2016 20:47
Hey, thanks for the reply.
Yea, i can afford to invest the time, and to be honest the tuition fee dosent seem that high when you consider it vs college/etc.However for a couple of weeks 10k~+ is a decent chunk of cash.
I just am in a situation where i know programming is going to be it for me and need to Cannonball myself into it.That's why the bootcamps are so appealing to me.After that i figure i can keep on learning and do some open source projects etc while i try to get employed.
But if they're a "sham" then im going to have to consider another route, hence the thread.
0 u/Matter_and_Form 15 Mar 2016 22:29
Honestly, the only way to learn to program well without a background in another engineering discipline is going to be spending years learning. That said, you don't have to spend those years in school necessarily (though it will certainly improve your hireability).
If you are coming into programming with no background in technical fields, the sciences or engineering there are whole fields you will have to learn to be comfortable with. You will need to learn new types of math, because even taking calc I doesn't mean you know the types of math that are used in programming (think linear algebra, statistics and combinatorics, logic, different base number systems, formulas and computability).
You will also need to know a decent amount about engineering considerations like knowing when and where to optimize, how to manage maintainability vs. produce immediately, how to design things such that you aren't constantly redesigning every other piece of a complex system when specs change, etc).
Finally, you will need to gain a very good working knowledge of computer science and computer skills meaning not only the keywords to type into a text file to make python do a certain thing, but how to deal with large volumes of text (search, edit, archive), how to modify your operating system (add libraries, activate kernel level functions, version management, backups, network configuration, possibly database configuration, etc), and how to modify your programming environment (X only runs with library versions XX.X.X, but my other project requires version Y.YY, using debuggers, etc).
While you could dip a toe into each of these areas in an excellent coding bootcamp, the likelihood of you even finding one is low, and the value of that is still far less than what they typically charge. You would be much better off finding a local programming group and sitting around there once a week or month and talking about programming, while pouring over every resource you can find about both your chosen programming language and programming in general. Chiefly, write and read tons of code. When you're not doing that, read stuff writen by people who write and read tons of code. Don't read stuff written by some guy who is a web designer who writes a little javascript and python for his clients, read stuff by people who write C all day every day. Read stuff written by the developers of your chosen language.
Unfortunately programming is one of those things where there is no easy in-road, no shortcut that actually will get you to proficiency... But if you take the time to become a real programmer you will be able to walk in anywhere and get a job, because real programmers are quite rare.
0 u/zquad 15 Mar 2016 21:14
Not related to bootcamps, but the best advice i can give you to pick up a language, is to contribute to an open source library that seem busy, hang out in developer conferences, hang around developers and start a project on your own. Esp the latter should accelerate your learning.
I dont know much about bootcamps as I'm a self starter and well super nerd.
0 u/Drenki 16 Mar 2016 00:15
I would say that the bootcamps are mostly targeted at existing programmers (or experienced hobbyists) who want to advance with a new skillset.
0 u/CodeBabes 16 Mar 2016 05:04
We'll fluff you over at http://codebabes.com so you're coding skills aren't totally flaccid by the time you get into bootcamp.
But yeah, we know a few people who went through bootcamps and did fairly well, and also people who went through bootcamp and moved back in with their parents, and we're talking the SAME bootcamp. It's all about how much you put into it, balls deep or just the tip, and for some people the structure of a bootcamp is super helpful along with the ability to ask questions of experienced instructors. That's insanely more efficient than figuring stuff out yourself, which is rewarding and helps you learn, but also ridiculously time consuming. Especially if it's configuration issues which don't even help your coding skillz that much. But the work must come before you can ask those good questions.
Also there are bootcamps that will take you for free, but take part of your salary from your first job after you're done. They are tougher to get into, but an option for someone smart and motivated, but strapped for cash. It's also aligns both parties goals much better.
-1 u/J_Darnley 16 Mar 2016 14:51
No. Bootcamps are scams. You cannot get hired to do programming without a degree. As for those stats, does flipping a burger after completing count as employment?
1 u/Assho1e 16 Mar 2016 19:00
Bullshit.
It's not true. If you can program and can back that up with actual code that works and references to past work, you can.
0 u/J_Darnley 16 Mar 2016 20:17
Ha ha. I might believe then if I ever get hired.
0 u/roznak 16 Mar 2016 23:30
Yes you can. I don't have a computer degree only an electronics degree. I also see many accountancy students entering the SAP developersworld thorugh field vby