Ironic… that moderator broke rule# 3 by telling you to report another sub-Reddit, and is wrong about the existence of this sub being against rule# 3. Here’s the rule that the moderator broke: > **While we allow meta discussions about Reddit, including other subreddits**, your community should not be used to direct, coordinate, or encourage… Mentioning other communities… **with the effect** of inciting targeted harassment or abuse. Here’s the rule that the moderator is wrong about: > **While we allow meta discussions about Reddit, including other subreddits**, your community should not be used to direct, coordinate, or encourage… Showboating about being banned or actioned in other communities, **with the intent** to incite a negative reaction. Notice the clear distinction between Reddit admins use of the word **“effect”** and **”intent”**. The moderator banning you with an automated bot for participating in another subreddit, then telling you to report that subreddit in your appeal, had the **effect** of you coming here to post a comment (which could have been harassment). Someone on this subreddit complaining about their unjust ban isn’t necessarily **intended** to make people go to another sub-Reddit. An **effect** is a consequence, while **intent** must be proven.

Take 2 seconds to report the mod message as spam and/or harassment. When trashy mods use an automated action to mass ban users for no reason, this floods the Reddit admin’s with reports that they are forced to acknowledge because of its scale. There’s only so many times Reddit will stay silent to mods wasting their time with this shit.

I edited the part about it being ToS out. When you report something to Reddit the “spam” option explicitly states “unwanted…automated actions that negatively affect redditors…. Or the platform” Turns out Reddit doesn’t enforce it since whitepeopletwitter and other racist sub-reddits have been doing this for over a year.

Report the mod messages and sub-Reddit for spam and harassment. The janitors didn’t realize it’s against Reddit ToS to use a bot to mass ban people who participate across sub-reddits.

Huh I never thought about time being a factor. That actually makes a lot of sense, I guess we aren’t far off indeed. Thanks for being civil it’s been very pleasant.

That’s great!

Yes I got on reddit again after seeing multiple top comments with factually incorrect claims, then to see that you left a reply doing the same thing you got called out for. Have a nice day

I agree with you too and I agree with your edit to certain extent. There’s obviously a difference between offensive words considered hate speech from a historical POV (ie persecution, murder, etc) and groups who want protection can get it. My argument however is simply that Karen can be **offensive** to someone. From my understanding hate speech carries that historical aspect that most slurs don’t have so that is not my argument (anymore, idr if I’ve said it is). The point I make is that if you look at other offensive words that have multiple meanings, while they are not equal in offense, they are very similar in terms of what makes them offensive. ie it doesn’t matter if the majority use the an offensive word in an inoffensive way (fag is a perfect example although many slurs also work like cracker or gringo), if a small minority use it offensively, that is to literally offend or hurt someone. That’s why I keep saying it doesn’t matter what any individual person or group thinks the word means when there is evidently a large group of people who use the word racially and targeting a specific gender. I agree that the word is used by a majority to not target specific race or gender and the few times I’ve used it hasn’t been offensively towards a group. However looking at this objectively the argument I made is pretty logical.

By stating my argument and evidence a billion times so that you can properly respond to them? Lmao. What do you want me to do? Change my opinion because you told me to and not because you made any arguments? All this thread is, is me basically talking to a brick wall that occasionally doesn’t block the sun from my eyes. If you can’t even form a counter argument after being directly called out for not having one... why would you ever claim I’m the reason this “discussion” hasn’t moved forward. Christ

Please define slur using an example. Then replace that example with Karen and explain why Karen isn’t a slur.

Hahah. My “rebuttal” was calling out the mod for enforcing a non existent rule. It was meant to point out how stupid the mod is by asking how that specifically breaks the rules. I’ve been banned without breaking any rules before. Telling a mod I didn’t do what they are claiming never works. I never equated them and even said fag is worse but please, don’t take what I say literally, don’t understand the very basic point of my response, and please do fall for low level bait. “Pulled up sources to try and vilify” What? I pulled up sources to prove that Karen is an offensive word based on examples of what makes other words offensive. People also called me Karen after I sourced anything and you’re implying that I care about being called Karen. “Called out for using a homophobic slur” So just saying fag not directed at anyone is using a slur? Did I just slur? I’m so sorry. Yes I’m crying my heart out like a Karen because I was unrightfully banned on a subreddit that you are a part of which is literally full of Karen’s based on most of the definitions in these comments.

Basically a joke to **you**. Just like that “slur” is a joke to me. Who are you and who am I to decide what is and isn’t a joke? Well it’s decided on a very basic definition that isn’t based on your opinion but on the opinion of the victims and abusers of words. Stop telling me what you think a word means while I’ve posted evidence from multiple places of what the word means to a lot of people. Also **i never once said they are equal, read better**

The argument that only some groups get protection from racism and gender discrimination is not a good one. I’m not sure what white middle aged women identify as. Let me think about that and get back to you.

Why? If I’m saying that a reason one word is offensive might make another word offensive. How am I saying those 2 words are equal? Seriously, type out an explanation on why I’ve implied that based on your opinion. You might want to look up what “compare” or “equal” means to help with your response

Sigh. Let’s just go with yes but here’s my terms of service style explanation that has to cover every tiny issue. My point is that if it can be offensive based on racial and sexual orientation discrimination to one person then the OP shouldn’t be getting bullied because of some random opinions as it’s most likely commonly used in that way. *like the f word is commonly used as hate speech even though it was/is used by the majority to mean something else* Edit: I’ll end it here. If you can’t dispute that the f word was used by the majority to mean something other than hate speech and you can’t disprove that a majority of people use Karen racially and targeting women, then the argument is pretty much over apart from little jabs that won’t progress the discussion anywhere. You’re the one who hasn’t disputed any of my points while I dispute all of your opinions and arguments with logical evidence and sources that you can check for yourself. You haven’t moved the discussion at all.

No my point is that the word is used an insult that many have linked to race and gender which means the actual racists and offensive people have offended at least someone using that word. An obvious argument is looking at another slur that has multiple meanings. If one homophobe offends an lgbt member with a slur that person now associates the meaning of the word to be offensive. It doesn’t matter what you or I think the homophobic word means. It doesn’t matter what you or I think Karen means. if there is a large number of people who use and know the word to be an insult someone’s race and sexual orientation, then it is offensive to at least one person. That’s the very basic entry level argument that is so logical that, again, earth is flat is easier to defend than to disagree with. Again, The entire point of my initial comment was to show the people bullying one guy for saying they think the word is offensive to them was to prove that it can be offensive to at least one person (didn’t think I had to specifically say 1 person instead of “some”). That’s it. Full stop. 1000% logically sound.

I don’t even want to convince people that it’s hate speech, I used the definition of hate speech to prove that I can be seen as offensive to some people. No one has even come close to agreeing that it is or might be offensive to at least one person. Which was the entire point with me defending the one guy getting bullied... everyone attacked him because they thought Karen could never be offensive. I tend to use exaggerated points/arguments to reveal obvious conclusions that I initially state. Apologies for my style of debating

Wikipedia, urban dictionary (again 13k ppl think this vs 1.5k downvotes), media articles, reddit threads and comments, and even with the definitions that say it’s only based on attitude - Karen is a woman’s name. Oh and I’d go as far as to say the mod who banned me thinks that as well since they said and I quote “racism against white people doesn’t exist in any meaningful way” which to me implies they are defending the word Karen targeting the white race. I mean why else would any rational person bring that up? It’s meaningless to the overall argument as I’ve stated before but post the origins of the word Karen since it has nothing to do with race. I don’t get why you are even arguing this in any form. I’ve stated multiple times that my position is that Karen can be offensive to some. That is the most rational assumption without even going over any arguments. The only reason anyone would ever deny that is if “racism against white people doesn’t exist” or because they use the word Karen all the time, don’t use it in an offensive way, and don’t want it to be a no no word. Very ironic because I used the same argument years ago when I was told I had no opinion because the word I used with a different meaning was offensive to some people. Hate speech - abusive or threatening speech or writing that expresses **prejudice against a particular group**, especially on the basis of **race**, religion, or **sexual orientation.** Particular group is white middle aged women like you’ve agreed. Race - white women as outlined by several sources. You can’t even argue that most sources don’t say “white” in the definition Sexual orientation - definitions include “women” but the word is also a woman’s name so... Seriously it would be easier to argue that the earth is flat than to say Karen isn’t offensive to anyone.

I never said they were equally insulting but of course you probably failed English

It’s a good meme. I laughed. I upvoted. I’ve had some not so friendly interactions so I apologize for immediately assuming motives.

Racist? That’s a first. Huh let me see oh 3 people calling you racist in less than a minute of looking through your comments. That comment you made though... pretty racist.

No I just don’t engage with people who are closet racists that race bait and put low effort into trolling. Big mad is a favorite of yours huh?

Damn bro. You really got me there. I’ll just block you right after telling you fuck off one last time. Enjoy. Fuck off

Right, to say that the word fag is offensive purely because you can’t change your behaviour is stupid.

lol you’re replying to my post. Lol You fuck off attention whore.

Don’t comment if you want me to shut up. Downvote move on. You literally fit in with previous guys definition of Karen by commenting. Ironic

Well thanks for participating in a subreddit full of Karen’s, fellow Karen. I wonder if there’s a term for someone who inaccurately uses an insult while ironically calling himself it?

Never been called a Karen before this. I have been told that I can’t say a word because it is offensive to people. Looking at it logically, taking a words meaning like women/bundle of sticks/cigarette/tired and a few people turning it into an insult meant to offend a group, is considered offensive. So logically a word that was literally created to offend white women and is only used by the majority to insult people might be offensive to at least one person. The stupid hill to die on is to say Karen doesn’t offend anyone. Edit: you saying it has nothing to do with race or gender means absolutely nothing. Again that’s based on your opinion. I can link Wikipedia and urban dictionary that has 13 thousand people who define it targeting white women specifically. Like I said. Evidently a word used a relative few in an offensive way makes that word offensive regardless of how you, personally, define it.

Yes. Some moron was trying to argue that Karen is not offensive to anyone (dumb hill to die on) by saying “You can choose how you behave. Choose not to act like a Karen.” So I took that line and replaced Karen with Fag to how hypocritical that comment is.

OkAy KaReN

Karen - trying to find solutions for problems that don’t in any way shape or form concern or affect them “Valid concern” that doesn’t affect you in any way. Keep digging your hole Karen.

Hahaha unironically calling someone a Karen while being part of a sub made up of Karen’s (based on your inaccurate definition). Hmm actually, complaining about something legitimately wrong being done specifically to you is not what makes someone a Karen. Ironically coming from a literal Karen who cried about a show not making money. Hahaha https://www.reddit.com/r/dune/comments/j5l0wo/convince_me_that_im_wrong_unfortunately_dune_will/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Sorry didn’t realize the point of this sub was to quit bitching and move on when mods abuse their status to censor opinions. I also didn’t realize by pointing out that abuse and letting others come to their own conclusions, that I’m demanding something based on my privilege/entitlement or that I’m trying to solve a problem that doesn’t remotely affect me. Seems like you have no fucking clue what makes someone a Karen but are attempting to use it as an insult. Thanks for proving one of my dumbass points. You have your own meaning for a word outside of what the word meant when it was created and what it means to the majority. Upvoting for the laugh

**new mod message** “Racism against white people doesn’t exist in any meaningful way” https://imgur.com/a/QLow1tj Banned because of Mods opinion. **mod then proceeds to break the subreddit rule and attempt to personally attack me.** Muted right after https://imgur.com/a/0cnOXT1 Just an FYI. Refer to my previous post. You can call me Karen all you want it doesn’t bother me. I couldn’t care less about participating r/pics and am completely okay with being banned for bigotry if stating the f word breaks the rules. The reason I’m posting this is because I clearly haven’t broken any rules and a mod decided based on their opinion that I did. All I did was defend someone getting harassed by dozens of people for stating that they think “Karen” is offensive, that person btw deleted all their comments. If that makes me entitled I guess I’m a Karen. Link to the deleted comments I referenced https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/j9s9w4/sign_i_put_on_the_door_of_the_liquor_store_i/g8m2w53/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3 Link to the start of my thread https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/j9s9w4/sign_i_put_on_the_door_of_the_liquor_store_i/g8mau18/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3

It’s so absurd but I do think in legal contexts like businesses or residency documents it might make sense when done properly. I completely agree with you but I’d say given so many cases like mine, it’s more “this person said mean thing about group I like, he must be punished for this, but I can’t be punished for anything I say about a group I don’t like” What is this world coming to.

It’s annoying and stupid but I gotta say I love the irony of it all. Conservatives have said for years that hate speech doesn’t and will not work simply because there will always be a bias when it comes to deciding what words get banned. Hate speech supporters dismissed that argument saying it isn’t true and yet here’s another example of that very argument. I saw another form of this when a guy got arrested for eating raw meat in public. Officers said he was arrested because someone called and said they were offended. So the next day he went to McDonald’s and called the cops because he was offended that people were eating cooked meat. You can guess what did or more accurately didn’t happen. I just hope that one day these people will be in the minority on one of these issues and a word they constantly use gets banned.

Yes to both. Your comment seems like bait so I just want to point out that I don’t have any problem with anyone using the word Karen. I was defending someone getting bullied by dozens of people (some lgtb) for saying they thought Karen was offensive. I simply pointed out the hypocrisy of groups crying about one word being harmful to them but not supporting another groups claim because they themselves use that word in a way that isn’t harmful. <- ie an example of the exact argument people used to say hate speech will never work

> So you are trying to say that a common name has the same weight as a slur used to demean a sexual preference? It’s all semantics. I made 2 points. The first is that if hate speech is a thing or words are considered offensive then all groups should decide what words are offensive to them and not just some. The second is that the initial meaning of a word doesn’t matter if it is used to offend a group today. The second point should be more impactful since the slur “Karen” (not name) was literally made as an insult and never had other meanings. It’s doesn’t just apply to the slur I used. I picked it because it’s probably the best example of a word that is used by the majority to mean something other than what the lgbt community says it does. Both historically and currently. It meant “women” then was derived to mean “bundle of sticks”, then slang was used to mean “cigarette” and only after each meaning the word was used by a small few (relative) to be an insult specifically aimed towards gay people. Even as an insult most used it to mean jerk or bitch and applied it to everyone. It’s arguable that “Karen’s” are discriminated against for being dumb, over dramatic, or entitled. It is used to describe a middle aged white women like every definition online says it is. The number one definition online and on urban dictionary by a large amount is racial (white) and all the definitions discriminate women. > Even then it's not like Karen's have ever experienced any actual discrimination I don’t think it’s a good argument to make that hate speech or offensive words need to be linked with tangible discrimination or a history that may include the target death of a group (that was big argument used in the thread I was banned from). To use that argument is saying that you (not specifically the person I’m replying to) don’t want to prevent any of that from happening. > I don't think it's offensive to call someone a bitch when they are acting like an entitled bitch. I don’t either and I have no problem with anyone using the word Karen. I only understand where that comes from. Note that I replied to a thread of dozens of people bullying someone for saying that they considered Karen offensive.

It’s all semantics. I’m against any kind of speech censorship but I understand that some people are offended by words. The problem that everyone has stated about hate speech since the beginning is who decides what’s good or bad. Getting banned in a thread where I get downvoted dozens of times by lgbt members for saying that a word they use might be offensive to other people, is proof that hate speech won’t work. It’s everyone decides or no one decides